- cross-posted to:
- privacy@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- privacy@lemmy.ml
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When these guys say “think of the children!”, it’s usually with their hands down their own pants.
For all those that truly believe this is no big deal, and honestly believe it’s about kids, and think all the commenters in here are silly or tin hat wearers… go read this:
https://lemmy.ml/post/46083470
Short version: US based company providing age verification has US Govt. surveillance within their stack that adds you to all kinds of potential lists, among other concerns. It also serves as a huge honeypot of data just waiting to be breached, and it will be breached.
For those in the back not paying attention: THIS IS NOT ABOUT KID SAFETY, IT’S ABOUT TRACKING YOU AND YOUR KIDS!
Never forget who is behind this https://youtu.be/Yd7j_u-wPoM
Regulate the social networks instead
There’s NOTHING Safer than having the Epstein Class KNOW where Kids are and WHEN they’re Home Alone!
-US Politicians!
Remember folks, age verification is personal identity verification.
💯 don’t call it age verification - that’s just what the unmasked scooby-doo villain is still hiding behind.
Well they could do it the right way where, for example, you go to your city hall to get a certificate of age where they check your ID. Then some cryptography happens so you only enter a public key from that certificate on a website or OS to verify your age.
The website or OS doesn’t check your ID. City hall doesn’t know your browsing history.
But I’m not fooling myself, that’s not the point of such a law.
no implementation of personal ID for internet access will ever be “correct.”
Exactly. Digital ID verification is in no way comparable to physical ID verification.
incorrect.
Please do explain why you think digital id verification is indeed comparable to physical id verification.
That’s not true. It’s simple if all you actually want is age verification.
You go in to the government building and show your ID. Seeing you are 18 or older you get to go to another room where they don’t check your ID, just give you a token saying the one holding it is over 18. Make the token like a FIDO key where you have a pin you set yourself.
There is an air gap between the validation and the token creation so there is no way to go from token to ID. You make the key use a pin so we consider it to be once usable by one person.
The issue is not about the technology. The issue is that we all know this has nothing to do with kids getting on porn sites.
You make the key use a pin so we consider it to be once usable by one person.
Now you have trusted the user not to provide the PIN to another, and the implementation is no longer correct. You’d at least need to use biometrics to tie the key to the person.
You are changing the goal. The point of this is to provide THE USER with a solution where they don’t have to give away their personal information to the Government or the 3rd Party site. We do not care about situations where users commit crimes as that means our focus is on the Government’s needs which they would already have met by just implementing a “Show us your ID” solution.
Now you could make the pin be a biometric so it’s physically connected to the user. But part of the solution needs to be that the token is not identifiable with the user. If I pull of my wrist band no one will know it was mine. If you throw out your token someone could go around testing everyone’s fingers and find out it was yours.
Without ensuring that the key issued to one person is not used by another, the key does not prove the age of the user, and isn’t that the whole point of the key?
no, the point of the key is to access infomatîon without giving away personal information.
Even a photo ID doesn’t prove age. It just shows a record of what age the gov thinks someone is. They are still prone to forgery, misuse, etc. There isn’t any actual method of showing someone’s age so we can skip that part and focus on what the actual need of the user is, accessing a website while not handing over more personal information than is necessary.
Would these tokens be unique per website visit? Are they generated by the user or the government?
It can be a shared token. For example a cryptographic hash. There are many solutions for the problem of certifying a token while giving no traceable data.
In most solutions there would be the traceability of knowing “User X went to site Y and site Z” but never knowing who “User X” is. There have been solutions proposed that create site specific hashes where it becomes more difficult if not impossible to track a user across different sites. So it just depends on if this issue needs to be resolved or not.
Personally I would be fine letting every porn site I use know I’ve been to every other porn site. If you wanted to go somewhere that you don’t want them to know, throw out your token and go get a new one.
Never say never there is ALWAYS a way to do things right. But our government is too stupid to do it. So it might as well be impossible. Kek
If it’s completely local I’m less worried than online verification.
I’m not uploading any age verification online. I’ll quit the internet first.
“Key questions remain unanswered, such as the definition of “operating system provider,” the type of verification required, the focus on major commercial platforms, and the potential scope beyond them.”
I guarantee this bill is unenforceable. Cars, phones, traffic lights all have have computers with operating systems. All modern tech has an operating system of some sort. Also how do you even verify age? If my laptop is offline can I just not use it because it can’t confirm my id? What about tech that never goes online but has an OS, like a calculator? I can’t believe microsoft and apple are not lobbying against this. Who becomes liable if an “underage” person is accidentally given access or if access is denied to an “of age” person. I can just imagine an emt frantically looking for their driver’s license so they can use the computerized defibrillator.
Microsoft is probably salivating at the idea of being the only legal OS provider.
Microsoft and Apple. The internet will only allow OSs from large American corporations.
I’d like to see the rest of the world say “fuck it” and carry on as before, leaving the Americans to censor themselves. But governments around the world are suddenly rushing to implement very similar terrible laws. It smells very coordinated.
Meta is funding a lot of the lobbyists pushing for age verification laws. Uncoincidentally, Meta both owns a stake in a company providing identity verification as a service, and serves to benefit from not having to moderate its own platforms.
Citizens United, folks. Because nothing says “freedom of speech” like collusion, bribery, and conflicts of interest!
And meta had a pretty big chance of just getting banned from being used by minors in places around the world, so it might not work out as hoped.
Yeah, governments all over are trying to implement the same shit, and I agree it’s coordinated. Many governments are also looking seriously at stepping back from reliance on US big tech firms though. Not that homegrown oppression and surveillance is any better.
But you KNOW the masses will comply because they’re told so. They don’t want to break the law…
But don’t some of these larger orgs fund Linux distros? Like Red Hat with Fedora?
It’s like Secure Boot, but without any of those pesky self-signing workarounds.
It feels like a Mr. Smith Goes to Washington display would solve this.
Just bring everything that has an operating system in it into the room. Cars, boats, planes, construction equipment, tractors, factories, knock off game consoles, literally every server on the internet.
Show them the ridiculousness of this and maybe we’ll get dragged out by police and charged with contempt of congress
Don’t give them even better ideas. To you it sounds ridiculous, to them it sounds like “we can ban people we don’t like from using modern technology by invalidating their age verification”
Go ahead and ban the people who are literally running the infrastructure they’re using
Will the sysadmins in Congress need to verify their age to use a server?
Will the sysadmins in Congress need to verify their age to use a server?
Yes. Yes, they will.
“Sorry, no email for your octogenarian Senator. TrumpID is down”
Offline computing?!
But
If my laptop is offline can I just not use it because it can’t confirm my id?
Yes. The powers at be will stop at nothing to take more, and more, and more power away from you. This is human nature.
The problem comes when a public school’s IT department is deciding whether to go with a FOSS option, or a commercial OS. As the IT team has full control over the FOSS OS, the school will be held liable as the OS provider. They will select a commercial OS to avoid liability under these idiot laws.
What is this argument? You and I both know they want this age verification at the OS level for personal computing devices: phones, tablets and computers, maybe watches.
Is this really what’s going to kill this law? Semantics?
Yeah, that’s kind of what laws are all about
Yeah actually. A lot of laws get shitcanned into irrelevance due to being worded like shit on everything from the local to federal levels. That’s not even getting into conflicts with pre-existing well worded laws or the constitution as a whole.
If it’s worded badly enough it may even just be thrown out on first test due to being vague and too widely applicable. Just for example I drive a 2001 Toyota Tacoma it has an operating system because it’s got an ECU, how the actual fuck would that interact with this law? Obviously the corporate answer is to force me to get a new car but the actual practical answer is that that isn’t viable, so it’s more likely the courts just gut an entire section of the law with one case. Keep up the gutting and sooner or later it’ll end up defunct.
Rules being implemented and enforced by actual pedophiles
*Ruling class rapists.
Rapist class
Pedophile class
They cant even define an OS. Do i need a fucking login for my wifi fridge and toaster. Such a stupid ffucking law.
You can’t open your fridge for beer until you verify your age.
Drink verification can…catch 22
Why does a fridge need to connect to the Internet? Or a toaster? Why does my toothbrush need Bluetooth?
OK, how about my surveillance cam? NAS appliance? My WiFi light controller? Network switch? They all run Linux.
Well now you have to provide ID to use any of those.
This is just another form of control and a potential verified data stream for governments/corporations/marketers.
How can you prove that internet traffic is a human and not a bot? ID verification.
How can you generate more user data? Force them to provide ID for every device that is connected.
Want to control piracy? Easy with OS level ID requirements.
Good luck, enterprise admins! Best wishes for the future
They will repurpose the same security chips that make digital payments and OS verification soon enough. Then you cannot bypass digital ID because it is on the hardware level.
Seems they are starting with software compliance to see who will voluntarily do their dirty work for them. Assume that M$ and App£€ will comply while making it difficult for smaller independent developers to comply thus removing any privacy options.
Same with Win11, force people to upgrade working tech because it lack hardware security chip support. Call it “anti-piracy” or “security updates” and force people to comply.
ms, google(android) and apple have already implemented this. it’s waiting to go live. there was a discussion about it quite a while ago.
that’s what this infrastructure is for. all of these bills are written with google/ms/apple accounts with subusers in mind.
California one doesn’t even have language to let adults have a user legally…
ultimately I think it’s apple/ms working with meta hoping to force people to use Thier software
No no, tell me more about the smart toaster actually…
Can it warm up a jelly donut and play Maroon 5? lol
Like everything on shodan basically? FFS
Okay, what is this bill actually saying?
That soon, you won’t even be able to own most computers without registering it under a government ID?
Because that’s fucking nuts.
Make guns connect to the internet and watch what happens then.
Your ammo is running low.
Would you like to subscribe to the Silver Ammo Monthly Supply plan?
Click here to watch an ad for one free bullet.
Amazon guns
#Writing prompt
Like JFC what a fiction concept! Oh wait you meant like to turn them on. I was imagining some loony toons shit.
Or track them if they are stolen
limit them to wifi range. Oh yea all realistic and logical things.
I was imaginging shooting people over dms
Old Mans War
LoRa
If only there were more support for reticulum.
I’m more interested in meshcore, which seems to take inspiration both from reticulum and meshtastic, but i’ve heard interesting stuff about reticulum.
I reckon that’s the plan
The way things are going both with the hardware market and government over reach it won’t be long until all we can own are thin clients that rent hardware from virtual servers. In less than 10 years we won’t own our PCs and will have absolutely no privacy or anonymity online.
Palantir really wants it’s fucking database.
All because Petey truly believes that there are demons living in the United States.
I keep seeing comments like this, and I just need to say, no Palantir doesn’t have any database. It’s a completely evil company that makes and sells surveillance software to governments and companies. Then the governments and companies have these terrible databases that they manage with the Palantir software.
Palantir themselves don’t do any spying or data collecting. They sell tools so that others can do that. They absolutely take the blame, but I want people to understand what’s actually happening.
there are demons living in the USA. all Petey has to do to find the closest one… is look in a mirror.
No the sad truth is that Peter Theil is, in fact, human. A human that we are all capable of becoming.
You just have to make a billion bad decisions to get where he is now.
Peter Theil and Sam Altman are why “queer owned business” is no longer an interesting label to be.
Tim Apple as well
I didn’t know, but I’m actually not surprised.
Nazis aren’t human. they are evil given physical form.
No, they are human and they bleed the same. The irony is that they don’t see the rest of us as human.
they need more summoning salts (full minor soul crystals)
The History of Superpower Implosion Speedrun World Records
He is right, demons live in US. They are in various Federal, State, Local and Corporate functions. For example current Federal government are all demons (pretty much) and all of ICE employees. Demon here is “spirit or lesser humanity” or simly said Inhuman individuals.
Everyone in this comment section, you’re just gonna take this? Its been time, but if this is what motivates you to throw bricks at politicians then lets go
They’re too busy throwing bricks at Sam Altman’s house 😂
If they were people of action, they wouldn’t have Lemmy accounts.
Will giving my unwanted opinion about Linux help this dire situation?
Can’t hurt
Hahahahahahahaha
Those violence inciting comments always read to me like “Hey, reply to me so you can be put on a watchlist”
Is there something that limits a person to a single lemmy account?
You know, to make that watchlist effective?
You access the Internet through a network owned by a corporation under the jurisdiction of a government, your ISP knows who you are and so your government knows who you are.
Both of our Lemmy instances are hosted by Hetzner, in Finland and Germany. Both instance’s connections are proxied through Cloudflare, an American tech company.
Any one of these entities has the ability to track you to at least an ISP and potentially down to the nearest street intersection if you’re using fiber/cable. And that ISP will have records linking your IP lease information to your identity, or at least the credit card/billing information that you provided.
The kind of people who would be putting you on a watchlist are not the kind of people who will be thrown off by simply changing usernames on social media.
Patience, probably.
Last I checked most of the instances had waiting lists and some sort of written answer application
squints at your username
Hit a nerve there lol
Take an upvoter because you speak the true true.
I’m having a hard time understanding how this is going to keep kids safe.
That’s because it is never about the children.
The same way the next laws will keep kids safe. When you leave your front door, you will have to drop your pants so the TSA can check your asshole. It’s necessary. You know. To keep kids safe.
/s
🤦♂️🤷♂️
Assprints are as unique as irises or fingerprints, and are bigger.
Reposted to death, but in case anyone new hasn’t seen Smart Pipe yet:
This is about protecting the entrenched players in the OS games; Microsoft, Google and Apple. The likely end play for all this is the erosion of personal computing so they can rent (and therefore control) all the compute available to you, so you don’t get uppity and think of running your own AI, which they believe will be as integral to everyday life as the internet is today.
Safe? Never. But it will help the pedophiles find more children online. Sickos!
Why would corporate billionaires and pedophile politicians want to keep kids safe? This has nothing to do with that.
I don’t even understand safe from what? Seeing titties? That is not bad and needs to be part of any growing up human, we’ve been all thru this, and we clearly see what happens to people who don’t/were banned from normal childhood. All sorts of freaks.
It helps the rich oligarchs track their child harem and broodmares and make sure nobody is infringing on their “rights” to treat people as property.
In the future, you’ll be sentenced to 10 years hard labour for a contraband OS while children are raped openly at lavish parties.
Don’t want to compete with a potentially capable Linux? Pay the government to make it illegal!
There’s already being work done to add an optional age-attestation in systemd.
And note that none of the laws proposed so far are actually verifying age, they’re only requiring someone to enter it. That’s attestation, not verification. Verification will be the next tightening of the screw.
They reverted the change and the Dev who made merge request got death threats.
Was it actually reverted? I saw the PR to revert the change, but last I checked it was closed and not approved
